“Flea markets proliferate a volume of goods needing to be sold and people who are hungry–emotionally and aesthetically–to sort out the meaning of life…. For most people who go on these ritualized scavenger hunts looking for something that they may not know exists, it is a kind of pilgrims’ process through the detritus of the past.” (Quote from a history professor who teaches a university course called “Stuff”; the professor is quoted in an article in the New York Times, May 13, 2011.) Sure isn’t my view of a day at a flea market. Anyone care to comment?
Photo: www.mariettaohio.org
After reading some of the comments posted here I think that the history professor hit a nerve. Some people were offended by his comments but I think that he might have hit the nail on the head. Some of us do go to flea markets to reclaim dismantled parts of our lives. My husband has spent the greater part of his adult life replacing toys and baseball cards that his mother threw away when he was younger. I comb flea markets looking for things that I saw as a child and admired, wanting them for my own some day. I do think that for some people it is a “pilgrims’ process.” There was nothing said in the professor’s few sentences to suggest that he doesn’t appreciate history or flea markets or the people who attend them. I took no insult. As to the work “detritus,” some stuff at flea markets is just that.
The thrill of the hunt! Plus stories you can tell and retell, of the great bargain spied 30 feet away by it’s sparkle in a bright sunny sky at an Ohio flea market….a 40 point diamond set in a heavy pinkish gold mounting…not marked, due to sizing sometime in the far past; purchased for $5.00!!! I knew the minute I saw it, that it was calling me! I’ve found some great bargains over the 47 years I’ve been hunting, but this comes at the top five of my life.
Such fancy words that seem to steal the fun out of cruising a flea market for whatever reason. Heck, forget having a reason. Just go!
There is a lot that can be postulated about the collector gene and several psychologist including Freud have taken a crack at explaining the deep seated motivation behind collecting. I’m a collector not a hoarded, differentiated only by the fact my collections are somewhat organized and if I trip over something it goes on EBay. Hoarders can’t do that. But when it comes down to understanding the weekly hunt it can be somewhat explained by the fact: it’s just plain fun. I use to get up at the crack of dawn to go mountain biking, now (that I’m older) I get up to go treasure hunting (a good 2 to 3 hours of walking). Same kind of rush, although I didn’t get buyer’s remorse bike riding. Collectors and treasure hunters each have their own reasons for doing what they do. All we need is another so called intellectual lumping us into one homogenous group. We’re all different but isn’t it fun to get together to compare notes. Now, it seems I do more visiting than buying.
Some people like dogs and some people like things and some people find it easier to get along with dogs and things rather than people. Who knows? Just try not to over think it!
For someone to presume to understand the behavior and motivations of millions of people who attend flea markets and reduce it to a psychological problem is elitist, narrow-minded, and delusional in terms of that person’s own sense of omnipotence and superiority. This mindset could be broadened to include archeologists, or even people who visit our greatest museums, after all, what are museums if not warehouses for the storage and display of “the detritus of our past?”
A professor of history is the last person who should criticize flea markets. There are many who’d agree that the study of “the detritus of our past,” is foolish and a waste of time. My advice to someone with this attitude would be to come down from your ivory tower and live with real people – life is passing you by.
For someone to presume to understand the behavior and motivations of millions of people who attend flea markets and reduce it to a psychological problem is elitist, narrow-minded, and delusional in terms of that person’s own sense of omnipotence and superiority. This mindset could be broadened to include archeologists, or even people who visit our greatest museums, after all, what are museums if not warehouses for the storage and display of “the detritus of our past?”
A professor of history is the last person who should criticize flea markets. There are many who’d agree that the study of “the detritus of our past,” is foolish and a waste of time. My advice to someone with this attitude would be to come down from your ivory tower and live with real people – life is passing you by.
It’s nice to now know why I am drawn to flea markets. I personally know the meaning of my life. I go to flea markets for a lot of reasons. I like the idea of saving money, I like reusing, and I like meeting the people and hearing their stories. I also like to treasure hunt, and while I am certainly not an expert, I have had a time of two when I have suggested a seller have an item checked before they sold it for a couple of dollars. I figure there’s enough treasure for everyone so its not always important for me to be the one who gets it. It seems like the flea markets/swap meets have helped me more than I realized.
Many members of academia feel it is their duty to compose massive tracts that dissect even the most fascinating concepts and make them dry as a mummy’s butt. This professor is a small example.
I see flea markets as a concourse of goods which transfer from one owner to the next, bringing along anecdotes that enrich and inform the buyer. It’s like buying a little piece of history to enhance your life and your home.
First of all, a professor gets paid university $ for teaching a class called “Stuff”? No wonder education costs are so high! His elitist view of people as “pilgrims who are emotionally hungry to sort out the meaning of life by going on a ritualized hunts for the detritus* of the past” proves he has no direct knowledge of the subject he “teaches”. But, that’s his loss. He’s the one missing the fun,adventures,surprises and treasures!
*detritus=disintegrated or eroded matter; accumulated material or debris
the remains of something that has been destroyed or broken up..i guess im the only one who agrees with the professor i go to flea markets, estate sales, auctions, antique shops to find the pieces of my past that gave me comfort…is it ritualilzed sure it is i go every saturday…and some things i am not looking for but when i spot THE ITEM that i wasnt looking for it almost always brings me back to my grandmother’s house and how loved i felt…sure sometimes im looking for other things like the pillsbury doughboy but it is utlimately the items i wasnt looking for that brings me the most pleasure…the most good vibes…thats just me though
This is a “history professor”??? He has no appreciation for history or it’s artifacts apparently!! I bet his students sit there with eyes glazed over in boredom as he drones on trying to attempt to get the information on his dried up pages into the brains of his captive audience….a true definition of horror!!!
I’d love to see the professor’s “Stuff” syllabus, but that description doesn’t adequately describe the variety of buyers I encounter.
Resellers – within this there are niche buyers, maybe they buy carnival glass, musical instruments, paintings, 1950’s decorative items, it can be anything… they are usually focused and know their resale market. Gold and silver buyers fall in this category. They can drill a price down until you turn them away, or pay your early morning price without arguing. If you get to know them, you’ll know whether they are selling at flea market prices, or catering to an elite demographic. They are a valuable and consistent source of sales.
Treasure Hunters – also resellers, these are wide-ranging buyers that will pick up anything that they think they can turn a profit on. Their choices are defined by their experience and sales success. Within this category, there are those that have rules that are personal and quirky, and not necessarily rational. A friend of mine has a 20/20 rule; it has to be under $20 and under 20 pounds. Ebayers fall in this category. While the majority are looking for under $50 deals, there are a small percentage that seek out higher priced items. Because they are looking for a hidden treasure, there’s a certain element of frenzy and compulsion to their buying style.
Disciplined collectors – they look for specific items, could be musical instruments, dinnerware, certain types of books, art, pottery, etc. They can be a great source of information and the good ones will informally trade appraisals of items they don’t want for discounts on the items they do want. Because they are seasoned flea marketers, they may pick up underpriced items outside of their interest. They are second to the Resellers as a predictable source of sales.
Random acquisitioners – these are people who buy what strikes their fancy. They are unpredictable but can be lots of fun to deal with. It can be three women out on a junket free of husbands and kids or a young couple decorating their first home, or immigrants trying to live on their university grant. There’s no set price, they vary widely in what they consider discretionary income and some are impulse buyers. I have a necklace that’s targeted to these people; it’s priced between $45 and $95 depending on the demographics of a given flea market. These are also the people who are most likely to ask if you’ll take a check or credit card because they didn’t think a trip to a flea market required visiting an ATM first.
Recreational flea marketers – they are the people who show up at 1pm and wonder why everyone is packing up. Depending on my state, the diplomacy varies, but the buyers are gone and most of us are not interested in servicing the window shoppers.
I have to say I think the professor is onto something. Poking around in flea markets, second hand stores and thrift shops was always a passion of mine. Lots ot times, I didn’t buy a thing. But afer I did some deep therapy for a specific life problem, I found I no longer went “junk shopping” as often, or as intensely, as I formerly did. Surprised me, for certain. I never realized I was looking for something unknown, that always seemed to be out there somewhere just beyond my grasp. Not true for everyone, I’m sure, but it resonates with me to some degree.
OK…I thought I was just having fun…must everything be analyzed???
Read the whole article and I believe you’ll see what the point of his class is on “stuff”. I think it’s a well-written article with a positive spin.
They came for freshly shucked oysters and straight-off-the-leg prosciutto. They came for clacking vintage typewriters and old LPs repurposed as dog tags and bracelets. And they came, to the Brooklyn Flea in Fort Greene last Saturday, searching for meaning and connection in their rudderless lives. Suzanne DeChillo/The New York Times
At the Chelsea Flea Market, classic LPs can be rescued from the trash bin.
“Flea markets proliferate a volume of goods needing to be sold and people who are hungry — emotionally and aesthetically — to sort out the meaning of life,” said Michael Prokopow, a history professor at the Ontario College of Art and Design University in Toronto, who teaches a course called “Stuff,” about things and their meaning. “For most people who go on these ritualized scavenger hunts looking for something that they may not know exists, it is a kind of pilgrims’ process through the detritus of the past.”
O.K. So, maybe the situation is not quite that deep. But in recent years, with nearly half a dozen major flea markets springing up across the city, the flea marketing of New York is all but complete.
There is the Brooklyn Flea — actually two flea markets, one in Fort Greene every Saturday and, new this year, another in Williamsburg every Sunday. There is the Hell’s Kitchen Flea Market every weekend, with its gourmet food truck bazaar every second Sunday of the month. There is the Antiques Garage and the West 25th Street Market in Chelsea.
There is the Hester Street Fair in the shadow of Seward Park on the Lower East Side, now in its second year, and the Green Flea all the way up and across town on Columbus Avenue. Dekalb Market, which is set to open this summer in Brooklyn, will feature shipping container storefronts, with vendors selling their wares in what look like urban, Jurassic-size building blocks. And on Saturday BK Festival flea market in Coney Island was to kick off its inaugural season.
The Coney Island flea, according to its owners, Tom Brady and Tom Walker, will distinguish itself with a state fair atmosphere — carnival and pony rides, concerts, car shows, food. But there will be absolutely no hot dogs, out of respect for Nathan’s, the men said in a phone interview, referring to the longtime Coney Island hot-dog seller.
In a city that thrums with opportunity and a veritable buffet of wonderful things to do — theaters! museums! parks! — flea markets have somehow emerged as many people’s first choice of a way to spend the weekend. On Brooklyn Flea’s opening weekend, about 25,000 people filed through the Fort Greene and Williamsburg markets, according to the organizers, and SuChin Pak, a founder of the current Hester Street Fair, estimated that 11,000 people came to her market’s opening day this year.
Originally named after the marchés aux puces — the markets of fleas — on the outskirts of Paris in the late 19th century, flea markets in New York have always been the playground of the city’s creative class. Andy Warhol, among other writers and artists, was known to haunt the Chelsea market. But now the markets have become true scenes, places to see, shop and be seen, all while washing down a $15 lobster roll with some home-brewed hibiscus soda.
The trend has gotten so over the top that, in a video shown in city taxis, the “NBC Nightly News” anchor Brian Williams simultaneously mocked and recommended flea markets to tourists, saying, “Go to one of those Marrakesh-like outdoor artisanal markets.”
“Brooklyn’s a festival this time of year,” Mr. Williams said. “They’re openly making handmade grilled cheese sandwiches, all kinds of leather goods, tin, silver. It’s like a walk back in time!”
WHAT, exactly, is behind the new flea market hegemony? While the foundering economy, the banality of strip-mall and big-box shopping, and the generally whimsical and serendipitous aura of flea markets have all played a role in their popularity, the real reasons behind their rise in New York City are more complicated and hardwired than even the most well-trained scavenger or vintage aficionado might expect, experts say.
Eric Demby, one of the founders of the Brooklyn Flea: “It’s kind of old-fashioned, and it’s about people interacting in the real world, which I think people crave more and more. The more online we go, the more offline interaction becomes a kind of romantic thing.”
Paul Moore, a professor of communication at Ryerson University in Toronto, who studies the history of the mass market: “Personal taste needs an urban space for fashion, like a flea market with an element of playfulness and randomness and spontaneity. We’ve got a nostalgia for outmoded, outdated and anachronistic items, especially when they’ve all been replaced by technologies.”
Old phones, old typewriters, old record players and old cameras, Professor Moore said, are popular among fleagoers. “There’s kind of an amusement value in owning something that has no use anymore,” he said.
And according to Professor Prokopow, the “Stuff” instructor, “It’s this sort of idea of material self-fashioning, a self-curation of life.”
(Another interesting question: Why do so many flea-market experts seem to hail from Canada?)
More than for any goods or services, people often go to flea markets searching for some ineffable quality in an item they recognize only when they see it, like the mid-century modern candy dish their grandmother always set out, or a Rainbow Brite plastic lunchbox that transports them back to a simpler time. And in the process of picking over other people’s junk, they are telling the world something about themselves: “I’m the type of person who ironically buys vintage ‘Star Wars’ figurines,” they seem to say, or “I’m the type of person who appreciates a handcrafted farmers’ table, and homemade lamps made from Mason jars.”
(In the course of reporting, this reporter was the type of person who bought a vintage, vaguely cowgirlesque, blue button-down shirt; a bottle of homemade ginger syrup; a shimmery silver Whiting & Davis purse that broke less than a week later when the reporter was running for a taxi; and upward of $30 in snacks.)
It also didn’t hurt that the inception of some of the newer, trendier flea markets coincided with the rise of the locavore, do-it-yourself and epicurean movements in the city.
Food occupies a significant space at many of the markets, with vendors selling items like Korean tacos, artisanal popsicles, entire pizzas with fresh toppings and, yes, even oysters.
“I think I’m taking my chances, but that’s O.K.; life’s short,” said Jane Keilty, 58, standing at the Fort Greene flea below a large “Oyster girl” pinup poster that read, “Brooklyn Fish Camp.” Ms. Keilty, in town from Massachusetts to visit her daughter for Mother’s Day, ordered “one of each,” slurped the oysters out of their shells and turned to a woman waiting for her order.
“Those were great — so fresh,” she said. “It’s such a great day to be outside and eating oysters.”
Many of the flea markets have actively encouraged a food component as a way to attract new faces, and Mr. Demby and his partner are opening a food-only market on May 21 in their Williamsburg space, which will be called Smorgasburg.
The markets also provide an inexpensive and low-stakes testing ground for vendors to try out their wares and to perfect their recipes. Ms. Pak glided around the Hester Street Fair stands on opening day this month, pointing out vendors who had gotten their start there, like the family of empanada makers who have elevated their recipe to perfection. There was also the stand with creatively stuffed risotto balls that are now the ideal size and consistency.
Simon Tung, a founder of the Macaron Parlour, which features flavors like candied bacon with maple cream cheese and Thai chili, started at the fair’s inaugural weekend last year and already has a regular following. On opening day, an adorable 4 ½-year-old boy named Charles zipped up on a scooter, wearing a fake-leather jacket cuffed to reveal plaid sleeves.
“Why don’t you open up your hand, little guy,” Mr. Tung said, placing a blue Earl Grey macaron — Charles’s favorite — in his palm. “He’s the only kid under 12 who likes Earl Grey, but then again, he’s a sophisticated hipster kid,” Mr. Tung said later, with a laugh.
Charles’s mom, Sasha Safdiah, 34, said she, her husband and their two sons lived down the street and “have never missed a weekend when it’s open.” As her younger son accidentally tried to climb into the wrong stroller and her husband whisked him up in his arms, she added: “They have food and antiques and jewelry, so it’s a good mix. It’s not just old clothes.”
Which brings us to the “curated” concept. Mr. Demby and Ms. Pak stress the thought-out nature of their markets, where vendors are carefully chosen for their diverse array of goods and quality level — but some still have undercurrents of more traditional fleas, what are dismissively called the “tube socks and wrench set.” At the far end of the Hell’s Kitchen Flea Market one day, a man was hawking “cuticle nail and mustache scissors,” and at the other end, a seller began yelling at a woman who had dismissed his estate sale clothes as junk.
“You looking for brand new junk?” he huffed. “Go to Bloomingdale’s. Go down to Chinatown. You can get new junk there.”
ON the whole, however, the new flea markets are a freewheeling space for self-expression. With a camera slung around his neck, Sung Min, 23, scanned the racks of vintage clothes at the Brooklyn Flea in Williamsburg on a sunny afternoon. In many ways, Mr. Min was the physical embodiment of the flea market aesthetic — he wore a typewriter key ring and a sleeveless old T-shirt, both flea purchases, as he talked about the “unique” and “cheaper” clothes he likes to buy there.
“Also, you can have special styles, like him,” Mr. Min said, gesturing to a man wearing green coveralls.
“I’m always amazed by these groups of cool young people, wandering around, looking for stuff, and I think, ‘If you didn’t have this venue, your performance of yourself wouldn’t be as complete,’ ” Professor Prokopow said. He described the phenomenon as “I have something that no one else has. I was different before I got this fantastic blank, but now my differentness is borne on my shoulders.”
But could flea market fatigue soon be upon us? “As long as there are things and people,” Professor Prokopow said, “there will always be places where used things and used people can go.”
I’m not even sure what this guy is trying to say. Those of us who treasure-hunt have our own individual reasons. In addition to various childhood ‘traumas’, and just a damned strong appreciation for the ‘stories’ of others, I also just love finding great stuff. Picking up a blackened bowl, and seeing the hallmarks almost hidden beneath, then asking how much, and being told, “Gimme a dollar”, then getting home and cleaning it and finding that you are holding a sterling bowl from 1848, and it weighs nearly a pound!…all I can say is it’s like an orgasm of sorts…
Try doing THAT in the area mall.
I’ve had an ebay store for years that sells mostly Chinese antiques, collectibles and other interesting Asian items (if its good art). I spend a fair amount of time explaining why this bird is shown with that particular tree, because if you know Chinese art, you know that nothing is random. There is myth and meaning behind everything. I wanted my buyers to know the deeper meaning behind what first caught their attention. Consequently, most of my buyers are .edu folks (academics) and they often start correspondence with me to probe for more info and to share their stories. I’ve been the source of many a collection, I am proud to say. So whether its a flea market, swap meet (what we called them in Hawaii) or similar type selling under a different moniker, you just never know what you will find…and these same folks DO find stuff! So what if a particular event is new stuff. The next one might be great stuff. A collector’s gene is always turned on and you just never know. For every yard sale with kid’s clothes, I have also found 19th century porcelain, Shoushan stone seals and just lately, a pair of late Qing brass stirrup shoes. I’m with sandycatgirl, who wrote “going to fleamarkets is just plain fun!!”
I like the “pilgrim process” part, but otherwise, the professor’s definition of a flea market is pretty dry.
The professor needs to get out of the lecture hall more often. The professor should remember the line from “The Matrix” – “Sometimes a spoon is just a spoon.”
That history professor needs to get out into the real world. Flea markets are for recycling useful things to new people.
For art projects.
Cheap entertrainment – sometimes we wonder why someone would buy things in the first place.
Treasure hunting.
We know who we are, that’s why we don’t need to buy brand new stuff with a “name” on it.
“…looking for something that they may not know exists…”?? We go to flea markets looking for things we KNOW exist, and this is the place to search for them. We are occasionally surprised by something we never saw before and it’s fun to learn about it, but if that were the purpose of flea markets they would soon cease to exist because very little would ever change hands.
I think what he is trying to say is that a lot of people who go to flea markets (car boot sales in the UK) enjoy looking through the available used, vintage or antique goods without having a shopping list!
I do find it difficult to equate this with searching for the meaning of life, however.
What a bunch of babble and, pardon me, dog fudge, from him. Lately I’ve seen ‘flea markets’ that had nothing but new junk. I got my money back and left after explaining what both a flea market and a dictionary is. There is conflict though within dictionaries even though the beginning of the term is because of fleas on used items. I love flea markets and garage sales! A cheaper adventure cannot be had in my book! I can have the best time, meet great people and find great stuff for a $20 day! Never miss the boxes under the tables or the ‘junk’ pile as there the jewels may be! I have one-of-a-kind things that the Smithsonian would want and have them because I looked in the odd place for them.
Is it the weekend yet???!!! Wheeeeeee!
I thought the “hunt” was for fun! Doesn’t seem ritualized unless always turning to the right when I enter a flea market, or show counts as a ritual.
The article put a smile on my face. We always joke about what future archeologists are going to say about us….guess they are already talking about us.
Lenore Gusten
http://www.gustens.com
IMO, the history professor’s observations are detritus. Afterall, one person’s detritus is another’s treasure.
He sounds like the guy who talks about people “clinging to their guns and religion.”
I love flea markets even if I don’t buy anything and I love looking at our colorful past. I ignore people like the history professor as they are usually boring beyond words.
History professors attempt to assign meaning to events in humanity’s past, typically through reiterating the themes and theories gleaned from work carried out by academic foot soldiers of history such as anthropologists, archeologists, and archivists. I am pretty certain of the meaning of life but for me, the trips to flea markets and the like are a normal outgrowth of me wanting to physically reach through the veil of history and lay my hands on something passed through the hands of ancestors. How absolutely amazing it was for me to find my first “Mercury Dime” as a kid with a metal detector and imagine the 50 years of history which had passed until I dug up that thin sliver of silver? Going on and purchasing a roman coin in Bath, England, I tried to conjure up the circumstances where this copper coin might have paid for a goblet of wine or perhaps some other essential good of the time. Sure, trips to flea markets are sometimes a way for me to discover something I may not know exists. But it is not sad, by any means, it is an exploration into this unknown on par with the feeling I got on Christmas Eve. You never know what you are going to find and that feeling of excitement over the unknown and respect for the quality of production from our past is immeasurable for me.
That professor has know idea what he is talking about. I have been going to fleamarkets since I was a teenager and I love it. It’s like being on a scavenger hunt, because you never know what you are going to find. I am always looking for things that used to be in my Grandmother’s home because those things remind me of her. Going to fleamarkets is just plain fun!!